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In reply to: Blogs in the Wild

I think the Indieweb is aware of the search problem but they have been focused on getting the essentials for individual blogs and stuff you can do with it up and running first.  I’m excited about their outreach to students and educators because I see students and academics seeing the utility for them straight off.

I don’t see mass adoption happening until WordPress builds it into, then lookout world!

But that’s okay. I think what you and I are doing will go like this:

  1. We hunt for homegrown blogs, sites, wikis and such just as we are right now.

  2. We build directories, webrings and syndication services that map out this world.

  3. The thing becomes a self-sustaining flotilla of: a) Talking, pitching in with each other’s projects. b) Experimenting with the format—I like to think that we’re developing an alternate timeline, as if blogs had replaced Friendster/Myspace rather than these other derivative networks. c) And customizing these directories and projects for subcommunities.


Those social network silos did a couple of good things even if they are going sour now. 1. They broke Google’s stranglehold on the web and getting found, 2. They offered an alternative advertising choice besides Adsense and Adwords.  This is something even Microsoft/Bing and Yahoo before it could not do.  They proved to the rest of Silicon Valley it could be done and Google was not invincible.  So I’m not anxious for the social silos to crumble too fast, I also get a fair amount of traffic from them.

(And that maybe part of the lack of wider uptake of our directory, webring, blogroll strategy, everyone is getting some traffic now by syndicating to the silos so they don’t see a problem.)

Anyway, I’m not willing to go back to Google being the sole Gate Keeper of the Web. I’ll fight that, no matter how puny my efforts might be. There is a story behind this: you have never been carpet bombed until Google has carpet bombed you.  I’ve been collateral damage in that.  It was things like webrings, directory listings, and a huge network of hyperlinks from little websites that kept my directory on life support until I could rebuild elsewhere. That’s kinda why I started reminiscing about them when the topic came up.  No I’ll never go back to Google controlling the web. I’ll never take traffic for granted again.  Part of the reason I’ve been posting so much is to try and build a reader base before syndication gets shut off.

So yeah, you and I are experimenting with versions of these guerrilla search tools.  We will see if there is any life left in them.

I can roll out a directory ready for submissions in a few weeks if I have to.  All the old directory scripts are a little long in the tooth but I already know the one I would use and how I would use it.  I can roll out webring hosting too since I found that Ringlink perl script. Or you can or we both can.  Again, if need be.

Public uptake is the key, uptake by bloggers and webmasters.  If they are not willing to list themselves, if the public is not willing to to use these to browse, then we have little chance.

Marketing plays in here. I just put up a little advertising banner for the blog directory.  Early signs are it has more visitors checking it out. We’ll see if that’s a temporary blip or a trend.

Anyway it’s fun.

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Replying to: Difficult or Silo?

Heh, well everything not on your own domain is a silo, or at least I can make that argument.  Not all silo’s are bad we’ve all just gotten sloppy talking as if they are.  Silo’s become particularly bad when they become monopolies: ie. Facebook, Twitter, Google.  But what you are trying to do with is exactly the opposite, that is create another independent outlet for both articles to be found and also blogs to be found.  We need more of these not less.

Indieweb et al.: Commendably, you have built using Indieweb tech.  But I’m not sure if the Indieweb, as it sits right now, is the best audience.  I mean, we Indiewebbers all “got ours”, we can talk to each other directly anytime we want, we have: webmentions, chat rooms on, Slack, IRC and maybe other places, we have Twitter, we have our own Indie News self serve aggregator, newsletters and most of what we talk about with each other is Indeweb related.  And there is nothing wrong with any of that, it’s just that, maybe gets overlooked by that audience.  I see you have opened things up so that more diverse non-indieweb equipped blogs can syndicate and I think this is wise.

There are blogs and bloggers out there, basically talking to themselves because nobody can find them.  They don’t know if anybody is reading or appreciates what they post because nobody comments and they have no clue about Indieweb.  They want to reach out but they don’t know how, maybe they aren’t techie, maybe they majored in English at Uni.  How do we reach them?  How do we get them to get off their duffs and nailing manifestos on  I have to confess, there are times when I forgot to syndicate to xyz because my post was not linking or Indieweb related.  I’m getting over that.

Difficulty: I think it is best if we have to do a little work to syndicate to xyz.  I’ve thought about what if we could syndicate via RSS but that would spam xyz out.  It does not need all my drivel, only my better (or longer) posts.  And if you incorporated RSS then the real spammers would take over sooner or later.

There is a generational thing here too.  I’m not talking about the Indieweb, but others on the web.  They have become passive, or at least it seems that way to me.

Keep at it.  You are experimenting with something good.  When all the massive silos like FB and Twitter go down or wall themselves off, people will discover the need for places like  They just don’t know it yet.


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Like: Difficult or Silo?

I want to respond to this but I’ll wait for morning.  There is a lot here to think about.

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I just installed the new Aperture WordPress plugin.  I’m not real clear on what it does but it gives me access to Aperture and Microsub and, maybe, Monocle so it’s going in the direction towards an Internet home, which is good.

I’ve been kinda waiting for this, but also stalling a little to see how thing go.  This brings me closer and makes the process easier which is great.

See also:

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Introduction The “best” feed reader is largely a matter of individual preference. There are many good ones. Most of them, including the best, are free like browsers. The one that matches the way you want to work is best for you. 🙂 No matter which reader you choose, it should give you some way to back up your feeds, preferably as an OPML file. You may also be able to use your OPML file to move to another reader, although the formats may not be compatible.

Like: Best Free RSS Reader-Aggregator | Gizmo’s Freeware

Wow what a great article.  It’s much more comprehensive than most of it’s kind.  One thing I’ve learned you really really need a feed reader in the Indieweb space and eventually on

In the Indieweb you are going to really want to follow all those neat blogs you discover.  On the timeline is purposely fleeting.  There will be people you follow who you don’t want to miss any of their posts or you just find that you are following too many interesting people and the timeline moves past too quickly: the solution is to subscribe to their blogs in the feed reader.  That way you capture it all.

It’s just an essential tool.  I use Inoreader, which is listed in the article.

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In reply to: Catalog of Internet Artist Clubs

Kicks!  Great find.  That is one of the best done websites I’ve seen in a long time.  I love the timeline bar graphs.

I’m beginning to think that the failure of early directories was that they were just piles of links with no sense of an editor or curator.

This got me thinking.  There was/is another directory model that I don’t think we have discussed much: the expert guide model.  When I first got on the Web I ran across The Mining Company which later became  A similar one was Suite101.

The Mining Co. was fantastic, but when they ditched the unpopular topics and became they were not as good.  Still About was decent for awhile.

Anyway the model was each topic or subtopic had an expert guide they would write lots of different essays on their topic, link them all together, and at the bottom of each essay was a list of links to resources and other expert pages on the subject.

This was a sort of hybrid: not just a collection of links but not a wiki either. The bottleneck was finding experts and keeping them.  Wiki’s were developed partly in response to this bottleneck.

These sites were excellent starting points when you knew absolutely nothing about a topic but needed to learn.

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I was checking out the webring stub on and the list of hosts.  As of 7/18/2018 here is an update on the information on webring hosts.

  1. – I tried to register. I get an error message “host unavailable” from my browser, when I fill out the form and click register.  Somebody might want to verify.  Could be temporary.
  2. Ringsurf – I tried to register.  Registration form has captcha  asking to fill in the code.  Only it gives no code.  Lots of things broken on that site, general state of disrepair and the “Marketing” pitch sends up warning signals in my opinion.
  3. – this is the only webring host not listed on that page, and it’s the only one fully functioning. It’s old but everything works: registration, ring creation, admin.  Somebody might want to add them to that page.

I don’t have editing privileges on the Indieweb wiki and registering and then immediately starting to edit would probably get me frog marched to the door as a spammer and rightly so.

Hopefully somebody will see this and confirm my observations and edit or something.

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It just occurred to me that there is a common thread in both New Urbanism and the Indieweb.  Both find that they dislike much of what their environments have become.  Both seek to bring back the things that worked in the past, but update them to present realities.

New Urbanism, is dislikes much of the automobile scale commercial, residential sprawl development done since the end of World War II.  Neighborhoods, commercial districts should be on a human, walkable, scale.  They seek to encourage community, face-to-face human interaction and neighborliness by adapting the best of pre-automobile city design while still accommodating cars.

The Indieweb, feels the old Web was fun, entertaining, informative and educational. They dislike the over-commercialization of the Web wherein everything is simply a platform to sell you something.  They also don’t like the social network silos, controlled by corporate masters, that corral most of the conversation.  Therefore, they seek to go back to a time in the Web’s past when, “the Web was the social network” not the silos of Facebook and Twitter.  Again, they don’t want to completely turn back the clock, but they do want to selectively bring back the good aspects of the Web’s past but brought up to date with modern scripts, coding and techniques that make it all possible now.

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